flammesombres (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)

@fathead8489 From one of the last pages of the John Bishop book: "Perhaps "you missed my drift" (424.31 [and also that of the Wake]). Never definitively "arrived at," meaning in Finnegans Wake "drifts" and is constantly "rearrived" at (3.5); and consequently it hovers in a state of continual arrival and is constantly becoming: "In the becoming was the weared, wontnat!" (457.20-21 [O.E. wyrd, "time, change, becoming"]).(the 500-character limit is a pain in the ass)

flammesombres (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)

@fathead8489 Personally, in the beginning I didn't worry about picking up all the details and just enjoyed Joyce's writing. I used Tindall's "A Reader's Guide to James Joyce" (this assured that I at least had an outline of what was happening chapter-by-chapter, and got me through the book in about four months or so). I used the Bishop and Campbell books on my 2nd and 3rd readings and found them really helpful (especially the former, because it doesn't simply give explanations of words, etc.)

fathead8489 (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)

@fathead8489 Also, I'm not saying this method is overly painful. Some of it is, especially when trying to visualize anything, or trying to piece together or visual any sequence of events, but I do really enjoy reading it out loud. I just wonder how this book is taught in school. I think I might be missing something. Because there is no way this line by line method I am using is time effective enough to be taught in school.

fathead8489 (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)

@flammesombres I already have Skeleton's Key. I must admit bias because I am a HUGE Campbell fan. I'm trying to go through each line meticulously using finwake [dot] com and other websites as well, and then reading the page over again out loud to get the rhythm, which as been highly recommended by several people.However, so far, this method takes on average 90 minutes to finish a single page, and I still wouldn't say I have fully understand it. Is this normal or am I doing it wrong?

flammesombres (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)

@fathead8489 Don't get Campbell's Skeleton's Key, get John Bishop's "Joyce's Book of the Dark".

flammesombres (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)

@richagatorp745 justified because he didn't know what he was talking about, and wrote his comments in this disgustingly objective tone. Do I honestly need to keep repeating this? He was NOT expressing "dissatisfaction", he was stating that anyone who liked Joyce was a "pretentious tard". That includes you! As far as his being "exposed to information", it's useful to keep this quote in mind: "If you do not seek, you shall not find".

richagatorp745 (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)

@BrianTheMusicMan if you read the comments below you will realize this arguments already been had...we cleared all this up a while ago...

richagatorp745 (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)

@flammesombres how is it in any way justified to put someone down who hasnt been exposed to the information necessary to appreciate or even understand a work? I would understand if you were putting him down for trying to justify his own ignorance...but you called him a "philistine" before he began to do this...back when he was simply expressing his disatisfaction with the work...

richagatorp745 (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)

@fathead8489 check out Joseph Cambell's "A Skeleton Key to Finnegans Wake". It has some interesting takes on Joyce's final work.

fathead8489 (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)

@BrianTheMusicMan I am making my 4th attempt on FW. Have you read it? Can you help me out?